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Post by Deleted on Sept 13, 2017 12:20:10 GMT -5
QS's relate to a SP and to get one you need to go 6 innings with less than 3 ER's scored. The way baseball is going now, not seeing many pitchers go the 6 innings too often. Besides with our setup we use Relief Pitchers wouldn't it be nice to have them get a reward for a win?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 13, 2017 12:36:51 GMT -5
No, because people including myself constructed teams based off the categories in place during the initial auction. I carry minimal RPs because my strategy doesn't involve them. If you add wins that increases the value of the RP position and throws a major curveball in the way some owners have constructed their teams.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 13, 2017 13:58:36 GMT -5
Well then with your team having I would guess more starters wouldn't you want to get a win when they win a game?
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Sept 13, 2017 14:20:30 GMT -5
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Post by Oakland Athletics on Sept 13, 2017 14:20:30 GMT -5
The thing is someone could have a pitcher like Julio Teheran who has a lot of QS but doesnt play on a very good team, limiting his chance of winning. Had Wins been a category whoever owned a player like Teheran might not have gone after that player as hard and may have have gone after a player like Trevor Bauer who has racked up Wins being on the Cleveland Indians.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 13, 2017 14:24:42 GMT -5
I would think most owners went for the best player available at that time, something like wins would just be a bonus for any starter.
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Sept 13, 2017 14:29:02 GMT -5
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Post by Oakland Athletics on Sept 13, 2017 14:29:02 GMT -5
People go for the best player based on the categories. Wins was not a category
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Post by Deleted on Sept 13, 2017 14:45:21 GMT -5
No, because people including myself constructed teams based off the categories in place during the initial auction. I carry minimal RPs because my strategy doesn't involve them. If you add wins that increases the value of the RP position and throws a major curveball in the way some owners have constructed their teams. During the draft Bryan and I had a particular strategy based on the categories. Whenever we saw a player posted who happened to fall into our strategy we talked about bidding on that player. Like LAA says above, Bryan and I made most of our bids based on future seasons and not only 2017. We constructed our team during the initial draft and then tinkered with it during the season. Oh sure our season was terrible but our team is built around the current categories.
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Post by Toronto Blue Jays on Sept 13, 2017 14:54:40 GMT -5
I will preface my comments that I am in a lot of leagues, and this one when I started became one of my favourites and quickly, my only critique was that the categories could use some fine tuning. During the first few months of the season, I found that the ratings for my players in comparison to other leagues, and their relative value didn't match up. i found that the top players rankings were filled with 1B who just happen to walk a lot. Also I found that having a quality SP didn't seem to matter a lot. While Arrieta doesn't the light the world on fire anymore, the fact he isn't this year, or last year a top 100 performer the last 2 years is more to do with the stats that we use, rather than his performance. I'd be better off just buying a handful of mediocore SP who's ERA hover around 4.00 than try to get an elite pitcher. I found the issue with the categories really came to light for me in a matchup against the Cubs. They had half of their starting hitting positions empty, had very few SPs, and a whole whack of RPs and were tied with me in a matchup for longer than I would want in a league. Because so many of our categories are percentages, they were able to win a lot of % based categories with a skeleton crew. I didn't think it right that with just starting a few SP, and a handful of hitters you could compete in any league. I thought about it a lot and I threw it around with another GM, and it really came to me with the simple addition of Hits & Wins (which are standard in most leagues), that the Cubs wouldn't have had a chance, and would normalize values in comparison to the output of the players. I don't hit the message board a lot as I don't really dig getting into debates about things with other GMs, but I did want to put in my 2 cents as I do like this league. Do what you will Josh, you're a good commish...if it goes to a vote, great.
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Sept 13, 2017 15:27:09 GMT -5
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Post by Oakland Athletics on Sept 13, 2017 15:27:09 GMT -5
I will preface my comments that I am in a lot of leagues, and this one when I started became one of my favourites and quickly, my only critique was that the categories could use some fine tuning. During the first few months of the season, I found that the ratings for my players in comparison to other leagues, and their relative value didn't match up. i found that the top players rankings were filled with 1B who just happen to walk a lot. Also I found that having a quality SP didn't seem to matter a lot. While Arrieta doesn't the light the world on fire anymore, the fact he isn't this year, or last year a top 100 performer the last 2 years is more to do with the stats that we use, rather than his performance. I'd be better off just buying a handful of mediocore SP who's ERA hover around 4.00 than try to get an elite pitcher. I found the issue with the categories really came to light for me in a matchup against the Cubs. They had half of their starting hitting positions empty, had very few SPs, and a whole whack of RPs and were tied with me in a matchup for longer than I would want in a league. Because so many of our categories are percentages, they were able to win a lot of % based categories with a skeleton crew. I didn't think it right that with just starting a few SP, and a handful of hitters you could compete in any league. I thought about it a lot and I threw it around with another GM, and it really came to me with the simple addition of Hits & Wins (which are standard in most leagues), that the Cubs wouldn't have had a chance, and would normalize values in comparison to the output of the players. I don't hit the message board a lot as I don't really dig getting into debates about things with other GMs, but I did want to put in my 2 cents as I do like this league. Do what you will Josh, you're a good commish...if it goes to a vote, great. I respect you as much as anyone in this league, but you kind of made my point for me, people drafted there teams based on the categories. Chicago loaded his pitching staff with great talent, he claimed that from day one that his pitching staff was nice. Betances, Chapman (Traded), Devenski, Barraclough, Giles, Brach is a really nice staff. You waxed him in K's and in QS so you won handily 8-4 and Chicago went 2-18-1 this season so it's not like he didn't pay the price. Starters have plenty of value. But someone like Arrieta who is rated 129 in this league so not far outside the top 100. But sure he'd have more value in a Wins league because he plays for the Cubs which is exactly the point, I can't help if people didn't recognize someone like Arrieta or as I pointed out Bauer has a little less value in our league because they play on a really good team.
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Sept 13, 2017 15:38:20 GMT -5
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Post by Oakland Athletics on Sept 13, 2017 15:38:20 GMT -5
we have 5 hitting cats that are counting stats and 1 cat that is a rate stat, so I feel like if anything we need another rating stat for hitting.
For pitching we have 3 counting stats and 3 rate stats
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Sept 13, 2017 15:42:18 GMT -5
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Post by Oakland Athletics on Sept 13, 2017 15:42:18 GMT -5
Trust me I would have love to have a couple of quality starters. I was at the top of the league in SV+H right behind Chicago and I was at the bottom in almost every pitching category except K's and you see how my season turned out
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Post by Deleted on Sept 13, 2017 20:24:27 GMT -5
Even if you built a team based on categories, how would adding wins take away from anything you did, it would seem to enhance it. Josh made a point about Tehran vs Bauer a number 1 vs a number 4, and this was done with the thought in mind that as a number 4 on a team that should do well he would have more value if we used wins than someone who was a number 1 but gets more quality starts than wins. So what if let's say Sonny Gray he was the ace in Oakland they weren't expected to do well so everyone drafting should have picked Julio Tehran over him? I have always known to draft the best player available and see if you can compete, maybe times have changed. The one thing I still can't understand and no one has explained,Toronto said ADD, he didn't say eliminate, replace, repeal he said how about adding wins. To me that would just seem to give us more points in a matchup and maybe it would eliminate some of these ties
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Sept 13, 2017 20:37:52 GMT -5
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Post by Oakland Athletics on Sept 13, 2017 20:37:52 GMT -5
Adding cats to eliminate ties is the best point made for this discussion. I'll step back for now from this discussion and hear from the rest of the league. We've only heard from 4 managers including myself and a co-manager at this point. We need to hear from more as this is a huge decision/adjustment in my opinion.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2017 6:46:17 GMT -5
Hopefully we can get twenty opinions on this
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Sept 14, 2017 18:02:10 GMT -5
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Post by Deleted on Sept 14, 2017 18:02:10 GMT -5
This is a heavy heavy no to me
You don't change categories in a dynasty
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